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« Blabla 18-25 ans » : différence entre les versions

Blabla 18-25 ans (modifier)

Version du 21 février 2024 à 21:50

5 673 octets ajoutés ,  21 février
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Le '''Blabla 18-25 ans''' (principalement connu sous le nom de '''18-25''') est un [[forum]] [[blabla]] de [[Jeuxvideo.com]]. C'est actuellement le forum le plus populaire du site en terme de fréquentation et d'activité, et l'un des forums les plus actifs du web francophone à raison de plusieurs milliers d'utilisateurs réguliers.
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Depuis sa création en 2004, une sous-culture unique en son genre a vu le jour sur le 18-25. Structurée autour d'innombrables [[Délire|délires]] (l'équivalent JVCien du « ''mème »'') mais aussi autour d'un vocabulaire atypique, cette culture en perpétuelle évolution exerce une influence de plus en plus remarquée en dehors du forum. En ce sens le délire [[Risitas]] est celui à la notoriété la plus étendue, et reconnu comme le délire le plus important et profus de JVC.
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Considéré comme le temple du [[Troll|trolling]] français et bénéficiant d'une liberté d'expression très importante jusqu'en 2017, le 18-25 a suscité plusieurs polémiques depuis une dizaine d'année, lui conférant une réputation sulfureuse. Cette notoriété est notamment dûe à une nette politisation du forum depuis les années 2010, dont la majorité des forumeurs ont révélé des accointances avec la droite radicale, et un scepticisme face au féminisme et à l'immigration.
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Bien que ces positions idéologiques ne soient pas partagées par tous les forumeurs du 18-25, ou bien à des degrés divers, elles semblent clairement majoritaires et sont régulièrement pointées du doigt dans certains médias qui obtiennent du clic facile en taisant la dimension trollesque du forum, ou en surinterprétant des propos caricaturaux, perçus comme racistes, misogynes, xénophobes voire antisémites ou complotistes.
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La plupart du temps les membres se surnomment entre eux "[[Khey|Kheys]]" et se qualifient fréquemment d'[[Élite de la Nation]], au second degré comme au premier.
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== Démographie ==
Comme son nom l'indique, le 18-25 est majoritairement composé de personnes entre 18 et 25 ans. Toutefois on trouve aussi proportion significative des trentenaires parfois père de famille ou des lycéens plus jeunes. Le forum dans son ensemble très masculin regroupe une grande variété de profils, de toutes les catégories socio-professionelles. Si on retrouve quelques traits communs à une majorité de forumeurs, la mixité sociale et de points de vue du forum reste frappante pour quiconque prend le temps de s'y plonger.


=== Difficulté de la définition de la communauté ===
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Quelques caractéristiques communes sont identifiables pour un certain nombre de forumeurs, mais restent hypothétiques quand on considère que beaucoup de personnes se contentent de lire les [[Topic|topics]] sans [[Post|poster]] (appelées [[Mots en -fag|ghostfags]]). Certains estiment leur nombre à 80%, ce qui rend toute tentative d'étude de la démographie du forum très relative. Amalgamer les forumeurs actifs aux forumeurs inactifs est une erreur souvent commise.


Un espace de discussion anonyme encourage également une exagération des propos ce qui tend à fausser l'idée que l'on peut se faire de la communauté dans son ensemble. L'existence de groupes de soutien à divers partis politique, et leur présence parfois massive sur le 18-25 pour tenter d'influencer l'opinion est un fait avéré. Les principaux partis impliqués sont ''[[Le Discord des Camarades|La France Insoumise]]'', ''[[Petits pieds d'En Marche|En Marche]]'', ''Rassemblement National'' et ''Reconquête''.
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Ces quelques biais participent souvent à dégrader l'image du forum pour un visiteur nouveau qui se fiera à ce qu'il voit.
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=== Traits communs ===
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Le forumeur actif ''moyen'' du 18-25 est quasiment toujours un homme jeune. Généralement introverti et peu sociable. Plutôt isolé, ayant peu d'amis et pas de copine, il souffre de sa solitude et se tourne vers le forum pour combler son manque de vie sociale en échangeant avec les autres forumeurs. Cet '''isolement social''' et la frustration sexuelle qui en découle constitue un des caractère les mieux partagés de la communauté.


Les relations homme-femme sont particulièrement sujettes au désenchantement des forumeurs pour la plupart vierge de tout acte charnel, et souvent de relation avec une fille. La '''[[Pulco|pucellerie]]''' est parmi les sujets les plus abordés sur le forum, et affecte environ 70% du forum selon les sondages.
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Depuis une dizaine d'année le spectre des opinions politiques penche clairement en faveur de la droite radicale et du nationalisme. Eric Zemmour, Marine Le Pen et d'autres candidats et penseurs de droite sont très populaires. Le forumeur moyen est opposé au progressisme  : le wokisme et les luttes LGBT sont  régulièrement conspués sur le forum qui n'hésite pas à s'en moquer. Il est également opposé à l'immigration massive et déplore ce qu'il estime être les conséquences de celle-ci sur le pays (insécurité, laxisme de la justice).
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Beaucoup de forumeurs sont sans emploi et vivent encore chez leurs parents ou grâce à des aides de l'État (le RSA pour les plus âgés), ce qui contribue également à leur isolement social. La précarité est un sujet régulièrement abordé.
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Cette tendance n'est pas à généraliser à tous le forum qui comprend de nombreux kheys ayant une vie sociale riche, une copine, un travail rémunérateur, ou ayant d'autres opinions politiques.
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=== Voir aussi ===
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* [[Célestin|'''Célestin''']] : Terme représentant de manière archétypale le [[forumeur]] moyen qui se reconnaît en lui, un jeune homme timide, puceau, casanier et asocial.
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* [[Antagoniste|'''Antagonistes''']] : Catégories de personnes généralement détestées par les [[Forumeur|forumeurs]] et empêchant celui-ci de s'épanouir dans la vraie vie (le [[boomer]], le [[yes-life]], le [[chance]] et surtout le [[golem]]).


== Modération ==
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Comme tout forum, le 18-25 est modéré par une équipe de [[Modérateur|modérateurs]], autrefois bénévole puis rémunérée à partir de 2017. L'intransigeance de la modération a grandement évolué au cours du temps et change drastiquement à partir de 2017 en raison de l'affaire [[Nadia Daam]] en déclenchant une [[Crise 410|Crise du 410]].  


=== Avant 2017 ===
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À cette époque la modération est assurée par les modérateurs bénévoles et les administrateurs se contentent principalement de gérer certaines plaintes. Le forum est peu modéré et il arrivait régulièrement que les modérateurs soient totalement inactifs durant un moment donné, notamment la nuit. Cela amenait à des [[Sujet glissant|dérapages]] fréquents, notamment des [[raid|raids]] ou encore des topics pédopornographiques qui restaient en ligne plusieurs dizaines de minutes voire dépassaient l'heure de disponibilité. Le niveau de liberté d'expression était très élevé.


À cette époque, une attaque envers le 18-25 amenait quasi-systématiquement des raids. Il était possible d'aller beaucoup plus loin qu'aujourd'hui en terme de [[Troll|trolling]] et d'actions malveillantes. En témoigne l'affaire [[Twitch Booster]], où des forumeurs firent télécharger à des streamers Twitch un logiciel malveillant codé par leurs soins qui une fois lancé sabotait l'odinateur des streamers naïfs. Ou bien le [[Pontcarré|hack du site web de la mairie de la commune de Pontcarré]] (grâce à une employée ayant donné ses pass), permettant au forum de déclarer l'indépendance de la ville en question ainsi que la guerre aux États-Unis.
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Cette période dorée pour beaucoup se termine à l'automne 2017 après que le 18-25 ait harcelé [[Nadia Daam]], journaliste féministe alors à Europe 1 qui avait insulté le 18-25, notamment en la menaçant de viol<ref>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yW39QY_PmOI</ref>. L'affaire indigne la classe politique, et notamment la ministre de la condition féminine d'alors Marlène Schiappa. [[Webedia]] est alors sommé d'améliorer la modération sur le 18-25.
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=== Depuis 2017 ===
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Suite à cette affaire, la modération se resserre fortement. Elle est assurée par des administrateurs rémunérés par Webedia, les modérateurs bénévoles se contentant d'un rôle "d'animation". Les modérateurs des forums extérieurs au 18-25 gardent un certain degré d'autonomie.


L"intransigeance de la modération est vécue comme de la censure par la majorité des forumeurs qui n'hésite pas à moquer et insulter les modérateurs régulièrement. La liberté d'expression est intensément réprimée, parfois de manière aveugle comme en témoignent les nombreuses plaintes de forumeurs voyant leurs messages ou topics supprimés sans raison apparente.
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De nombreux sujets sensibles sont devenus inabordables sans risquer une suppression, une sanction, voire un bannissement. Certains sujets sont pourtant peu modérés comme les critiques de la politique sanitaire du gouvernement et promouvant ce qui est considéré dans les médias mainstream comme des théories du complot. Malgré la fermeté de la modération, le ban IP n'est toujours pas en vigueur rendant facile le contournement du bannissement en utilisant une adresse email jetable afin de créer un [[Secondaire|nouveau compte]].
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La dénonciation par la [[DDB]] est devenu un sport pratiqué par une minorité de forumeurs qui signalent massivement topics et messages, contribuant activement à l'efficacité de la modération. Ainsi certains forumeurs signalent volontiers un topic qui ne leur plaît pas, un message avec lequel ils sont en désaccord, ou par pur plaisir d'agacer.
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L'effectivité de la modération est affaiblie par l'apparition successive de [[Bruiter]] puis [[JVArchive]], qui archivent la grande majorité des messages supprimés. Suite à ce renforcement soudain de la modération, une frange plus radicale du forum va le quitter et migrer sur [[Avenoel]].
OWNED BY DASK discord.gg/daskaz


=== Bilan du renforcement ===
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Les controverses médiatiques impliquant le 18-25 sont devenues de plus en plus rare. Toutefois, le forum a un niveau d'activité similaire jusqu'en 2022. C'est donc une réussite à tous les niveau pour [[Webedia]], pour qui le 18-25 n'est plus une source de controverse mais qui bénéficie encore de l'existence du forum. En ce sens, dans le livre "''Les grands remplacés''" de Paul Congé voulant documenter l'extrême-droite en ligne, le forum n'est mentionné que 14 fois contre 39 fois pour [[Avenoel]].  


Ce bouleversement a transformé en profondeur le forum qui est en baisse constante de qualité. Pas un jour ne passe sans que les [[Forumeur|forumeurs]] ne se plaignent de cette censure souvent aveugle, et il est devenu très difficile de ne pas se faire [[Bannissement|bannir]] en postant régulièrement. En 2022 et les années suivantes on observe une baisse de la fréquentation d'environ 25% sur le 18-25, notamment des suites d'une [[Grande Migrationche de 2023|migration vers Onche.org]] qui fit grand bruit en mars 2023.  
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Aujourd'hui la modération supprime entre 800 et 1200 topics par jour<ref>https://jvarchive.com/410</ref>, selon la fréquentation du forum et la ferveur de l'actualité. Une étude de la Commission Européenne montre que Jeuxvideo.com surclasse tous les autres réseaux sociaux et sites d'envergure en terme de censure et de traitement des alertes<ref name=":0">https://commission.europa.eu/strategy-and-policy/policies/justice-and-fundamental-rights/combatting-discrimination/racism-and-xenophobia/eu-code-conduct-countering-illegal-hate-speech-online_en</ref>.
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La communauté s'est morcelée sur plusieurs espaces de discussion. Certains ont migré vers d'autres forums [[JV-like|JVC-like]] comme [[Onche.org]], [[2Sucres]], [[AveNoel|Avenoel]], [[LeBUNKER.Net|lebunker.net]] ou [[4Sucres|4sucres.org]], d'autres se sont réfugiés sur des serveurs discord. On appelle l'ensemble de ces sous-communautés la [[kheyosphère]].
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==Présentation du forum==


Autrefois, le 18-25 était très nostalgique des 90's. On voyait régulièrement apparaître des topics comme : musiques des 90's, dessins animés des 90's ou encore pubs des 90's. Cependant, les années passèrent et aujourd'hui le 18-25 a vu sa population rajeunir avec l'arrivée de nouveaux [[forumeurs]] issus du [[15-18]]. Cette influence fit peu à peu disparaître la nostalgie des 90’s, que les plus jeunes n'ont vraisemblablement pas connues.
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Les discussions sur le forum sont souvent orientées autour de thèmes récurrents qui évoluent fortement avec les années, par exemple les filles, le féminisme (ou "fémi-nazisme"), la vie sociale ou professionnelle et surtout la vie sexuelle notamment la virginité (selon plusieurs sondages à grande échelle, 60% des forumeurs seraient encore vierges [https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSeRrVQxdUlJRHiz2MpctjFmN3FGQarCU-q6Sd-YV6yV9UeJwA/viewanalytics sond.1], [https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1QytbJ0ICt84OenoXr4c4cru5o5_KnAPPBb00uLd4oko/viewanalytics sond. 2 ]).
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D'autres discussions ou délires portent sur des personnalités comme [[Alain Soral]], [[Rockefeller]], [[Larry Silverstein]], certaines personnalités sont aussi propres au forum comme par exemple [[Jemiscor]]{{CDV|Pseudo=Jemiscor}} (pseudo banni depuis, il poste en tant que JemiscorXXXXXXX) aussi appelé [[Jemis]], connu pour son comportement envers les filles (voir sa vidéo sur le viol doux) ou encore sa mitraillette 30%. Cosinus_de_x{{CDV|Pseudo=cosinus_de_x}} (représentant le forumeur lambda, puceau, cherchant une petite amie) ou [[Barta]]{{CDV|Pseudo=barta}} (connue pour ses fautes d'orthographe et pour avoir montré une fois ses seins et sa robe de chambre rose) qui a même une chanson à elle [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOJ2nwBLgmo].
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Le [[forum]] a ainsi créé de nombreux codes qui lui sont propres ; notamment les réponses types telles que "''Go muscu''", "''A gerber cette jeunesse, wallah''"  ainsi que le combo "''Cigare, Whisky, Figaro, Jazz, etc''" popularisé par le forumeur [[negmarron]]{{CDV|Pseudo=negmarron}} et utilisé comme satire du [[forumeur]] d'élite, qui passe son temps à se cultiver seul et laisse la "masse" s'abrutir en boîte. [[Jarkamitichz]]{{CDV|Pseudo=jarkamitichz}} poste régulièrement des topics proposant une version "améliorée" de cela, critiquant la société de consommation et faisant l'apologie de son esprit "éclairé".
[[Keitaro]]{{CDV|Pseudo=keitaro}} pour sa haine profonde envers tous. Ou [[Wouiz]]{{CDV|Pseudo=wouiz}}, connu pour être un [[modo]] fantôme et maintenant une danseuse cachée sous [[secondaire]]. ([[Cronosom]])


En outre, observer quelqu'un bider est quelque chose de moins exceptionnel que sur le [[15-18]], mais constitue toujours, en soi, une épreuve, une tristesse...
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C'est aussi sur le 18-25 que se trouve le fameux "Blabla de sanglots", réputé pour être le plus gros [[topic]] de l'histoire de Jeuxvideo.com avec près de 1.100.000 messages. [[Maxbp91]]{{CDV|Pseudo=maxbp91}} y poste souvent.


Le 18 25 est devenu connu des médias grâce à l'affaire [[HommeMort]]. Le 14 mai 2013, vers 19:21, il poste un topic sur le forum dans lequel il fait part de son intention de se suicider et de tuer beaucoup de personnes dans un certain lycée. Son [[topic]] est supprimé le lendemain. Le [[topic]] est d'abord pris pour un énième [[fake]], mais à l'approche de la date fatidique (vendredi 17 mai 2013), l'affaire prend une grande ampleur et est relayée par tous les médias français : TF1, BFM TV, etc. Un dispositif de surveillance policière est mis en place autour de tous les lycées de Strasbourg (le topic a été posté depuis un cybercafé strasbourgeois), comprenant environ 750 policiers mobilisés.
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HommeMort a finalement été interpellé par la police le mardi 7 juillet 2013.


Comme les autres forums du site, le 18-25 est majoritairement peuplé par des hommes, les filles représentent 5 à 6% de la population selon plusieurs sondages.
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== Histoire du forum ==
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=== Frise chronologique du forum ===
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''Construction de la frise en cours... Depuis 2142''


[[File:frise_18-25.jpeg|400px]]
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=== Le Forum Bla-Bla de 2000 à 2004 ===
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[[Fichier:Capture d’écran 2022-12-29 à 15.30.03.png|vignette|Le [[Forum BlaBla|Forum Bla-Bla]] à ses débuts<ref>https://web.archive.org/web/20020328105127if_/http://www.jeuxvideo.com:80/</ref>.]]
Dès ses débuts en 1997 le site Jeuxvideo.com met à disposition plusieurs forums rudimentaires autour du jeu vidéo, des trucs et astuces, des jeux en réseau.


C'est début 2000 que le [[blabla]] originel appelé "'''[[Forum BlaBla]]'''" est créé afin que les utilisateurs puissent parler d'autre chose que de jeux-vidéos. La description du forum est : ''Un forum totalement libre, ou vous pouvez donner libre cours à votre imagination! Dans la limite de la légalite ;-)''
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Sur ce forum se réunissaient les rares enfants et adolescents ayant accès à un ordinateur. À l'époque le [[Kikoolol|kikoololisme]] était omniprésent et les messages étaient écrits n'importe comment, les [[Smiley|smileys]] n'existaient même pas encore (ils n'arrivèrent qu'à la mi-2003). La plupart des fonctionnalités du forum n'existaient pas encore. On pouvait créer un pseudo sans mail ce qui encourageait le flood.
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[https://www.jeuxvideo.com/forums/42-51-71478089-1-0-1-0-ahi-le-forum-blabla-il-y-a-vingt-ans.htm Topic réunissant de nombreux screens datant de cette époque.]<gallery widths="90" heights="140">
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Fichier:jeuxvideo.com site 2000 ancien archive blabla.png|Vers février 2000 un nouveau forum apparaît: le Forum Bla-Bla<ref>https://web.archive.org/web/20000229082534if_/http://www.jeuxvideo.com:80/</ref>.
Fichier:Capture d’écran 2022-12-29 à 15.28.29.png|Au milieu de la nuit début 2002<ref>https://web.archive.org/web/20030209033408if_/http://www1.jeuxvideo.com:80/</ref>.
Fichier:Capture d’écran 2022-12-29 à 15.30.12.png|En 2003.
Fichier:Capture d’écran 2022-12-29 à 15.33.39.png|En février 2003 le matin<ref>https://web.archive.org/web/20030209033408if_/http://www1.jeuxvideo.com:80/</ref>.
Fichier:Capture d’écran 2022-12-29 à 15.34.23.png|Le -15 en juillet 2004<ref>https://web.archive.org/web/20030209033408if_/http://www1.jeuxvideo.com:80/</ref>.
</gallery>C'est le 17 mars 2004 que le Forum Bla-Bla sera séparé en cinq forums en fonction de la tranche d'âge des forumeurs. Le [[Blabla moins de 15 ans|blabla -15 ans]] hérite de tous les anciens [[Topic|topics]] du forum originel, tandis que les autres forums ouvrent vierges. Sur le blabla 18-25 ans [https://www.jeuxvideo.com/forums/1-51-1-1-0-1-0-0.htm Le premier topic] est créé par le forumeur ''Alex''.


[https://www.jeuxvideo.com/dossiers/00011660/les-debuts-de-jeuxvideo-com-mars-1997-lancement-de-jeuxvideo-com-003.htm Article de Jeuxvideo.com sur son histoire].
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===Le forum entre 2011 et 2013===
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Durant cette période, l'activité du forum était bien moindre qu'actuellement. Il n'était pas rare que le matin ou l'après-midi, les topics de la première page y restent pendant 5 minutes. La maturité y était également plus adulte. La modération était plus détendue. [https://www.jeuxvideo.com/forums/1-51-39103694-1-0-1-0-o-un-grand-classique-de-salle-au-prix-o.htm Les fics du forumeur ''Salle-aux-prix''] comme ''Bordel en boite de night avec mes Potos'' ou ''Mes vacances de beauf avec ma famille'' et les fakes de ''Germifrais'' déchainaient les passions<ref>https://www.jeuxvideo.com/forums/message/718143310</ref>. Les canulars téléphoniques de [[SigSawer]] comme " Bonjour , je voudrai un kébab " rendaient hilare la vaste majorité du forum. Même si les topics nominatifs étaient interdits, il y avait plusieurs epops sur le forum : toxiii, flartho, keitaro ... Ils se retrouvaient sur des topics qui tournaient en blablas avec des privates jokes. La relation entre [[Meego]] et [[Lucebuck]] était très médiatisée. On pouvait suivre les pérégrinations de [[cosinus_de_x]] pour se dépuceler, il s'est notamment fait coacher par un mec du forum IRL. Le 1 mai 2011, un forumeur, dont on a oublié le pseudo , poste un [https://www.jeuxvideo.com/forums/1-51-16514967-1-0-1-0-si-vous-auriez-un-death-note.htm topic] légendaire nommé Si vous auriez un Death Note, il raconte dans le premier message qu'il verrait bien Ben Laden y passer, le lendemain la nouvelle tombe: Ben Laden est mort, ce topic devient vite viral et culte.
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Mi-juin 2011, le forumeur [[Folaillon]] devient célèbre pour avoir répondu à [http://www.jeuxvideo.com/forums/1-51-17643535-1-0-1-0-nofake-ma-copine-rage.htm un topic]. Cela entraînera un des lynchages en chaîne les plus spectaculaires de l'époque, son pseudo désignant désormais une personne n'ayant pas compris quelque chose d'évident, et qui est encore utilisé jusqu'à présent. Le leak du sein de [[Barta]], le 27 février 2013 a mis le forum sens dessus dessous. Elle assume et y fait référence dans son avatar. Le 2 mai 2013, [[hades_0h00]] crée un topic où il se plaint du temps qui passe. Ce topic sera caractérisé par une succession de "up" s'étalant encore aujourd'hui, où des forumeurs se plaindront aussi ironiquement du temps qui passe en affirmant qu'ils se rappellent du topic "comme si c'était hier". Le 6 juillet 2013, Meego avoue avoir fait un don de 200 euros à l'UMP<ref>http://www.jeuxvideo.com/forums/1-51-45558295-2-0-1-0-votre-don-a-l-ump-combien.htm#message_45558611</ref>. Il utilise, pour se rassurer, l'euphémisme "''au pire c'est le prix d'une Vita, donc voilà...''" duquel est partie une série de montages mettant en scène des membres du parti tels que Nicolas Sarkozy et Jean-François Copé en train de se moquer de Meego et de réclamer des Vita.
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C'est durant ces années que le [[Blabla 15-18 ans|forum 15-18 ans]] se vide de plus en plus pour se transvaser dans le 18-25. Cet évènement appelé ''[https://jvarchive.com/forums/42-51-70843237-1-0-1-0-comment-sest-faite-la-migration-du-15-18-au-18-25 La Grande Migration]'' s'est étalé sur plusieurs mois, et s'est d'autant renforcé lorsque les compteurs de connectés sont apparus suite à [[Projet Respawn|Respawn]]. On s'est alors rendu compte que le 18-25 était bien plus peuplé que le 15-18 qui tournait en boucle sur des délires puérils. Les forumeurs du 15-18 désiraient embrasser de nouveaux horizons, et suivirent cette migration, la plus importante et radicale du site à ce jour. Cela lia le destin des deux forums : le 15-18 est aujourd'hui considéré comme la version enfantine du 18-25 qui en est le prolongement, la communauté qui transcende ces deux forums étant passée de l'un à l'autre.
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Un des délires majeurs qui s’est un peu atténué aujourd'hui est "''L'élite de la nation''". Tous les forumeurs gagnaient 8k/mois, avaient un BAC+8, un Z de 30cm, une vaste culture G. Leur loisir favori était de lire le Figaro en écoutant du Jazz avec un bon cigare. Le "Go Muscu" était très populaire, tiré du culturiste [[Zyzz]]. La vidéo de Dimitri apprenant la destitution de [[Meego]] avait beaucoup tourné. Les délires du forums ont tendance à s'exporter : le terme "PLS" dont son auteur [[CaptainNoel]] est originaire du 15-18 et du 18-25 est rentré dans le langage courant d'internet et de la vie réelle.  
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Depuis l'affaire [[Homme Mort]] (voir plus haut), le forum a été beaucoup plus surveillé et modéré, modifiant l'ambiance. La migration depuis le 15-18 a pris de l'ampleur et a accéléré ce phénomène.
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=== Histoire du forum en 2014 ===
=== Histoire du forum en 2014 ===
Utilisateur anonyme
Récupérée de « https://jvflux.fr/Spécial:MobileDiff/149513 »